When President Trump took to Truth Social earlier this year and attacked Pope Leo for being “WEAK on Crime, and terrible for Foreign Policy,” most Catholics were understandably shocked. But a clash between a secular leader and the bishop of Rome is hardly without precedent. This week on “Jesuitical,” hosts Zac Davis and Ashley McKinless talk with Miles Pattenden, an expert on popes and papal conclaves, about the long and quirky history of feuds between popes and politicians.

In Signs of the Times, Zac and Ashley discuss the Vatican rejection of a request from the German bishops to allow lay people to preach the homily at Mass. Plus, a look ahead at Pope Leo’s summer plans.

And in As One Friends Speak to Another, America Media’s O’Hare fellows—Brigid McCabe, Ed Desciak and Will Gualitiere—share some spiritual insights from a year working at the intersection of the church and the world.

Jesuitical listener survey: https://forms.gle/yggZcBKeXYKbWYpM7

00:00 Context
2:47 Vatican says "no" to women preaching
12:07 Pope Leo's summer schedule
16:05 History of Catholic authority
19:46 The investiture controversy
26:03 Pastoral concern or power grabs?
34:27 Henry VIII vs. Popes
39:20 How the church lost power
43:10 Moral authority on the global stage
52:00 Donald Trump's attacks on Pope Leo
1:00:10 Fill out our listener survey! https://forms.gle/yggZcBKeXYKbWYpM7
1:01:12 Faith sharing with our Fellows!

Learn about America Magazine's Joseph A. O’Hare, S.J., Postgraduate Media Fellowship: https://www.americamagazine.org/ohare-fellows

Jesuitical listener survey: https://forms.gle/yggZcBKeXYKbWYpM7

Links:
Vatican to German bishops: No lay people preaching homilies at Mass: https://www.americamagazine.org/vatican-dispatch/2026/06/23/german-bishops-vatican-lay-preaching
Extraordinary consistory signals Pope Leo’s push to work with cardinals on global challenges: https://www.americamagazine.org/news/2026/06/23/pope-leo-consistory-cardinals-june
Pope Leo speaks out on SSPX ordinations and U.S.-Iran deal: https://www.americamagazine.org/vatican-dispatch/2026/06/16/pope-leo-sspx-schism-bishopsiran-us-peace-reaction
Pope Leo to accept Liberty Medal and address Americans on July 3: https://www.americamagazine.org/vatican-dispatch/2026/03/16/pope-leo-to-accept-liberty-medal-and-address-americans-on-july-3
Electing the Pope in Early Modern Italy, 1450-1700: https://www.amazon.com/Electing-Early-Modern-Italy-1450-1700/dp/0198797443

Please consider supporting this content by becoming a digital subscriber to America magazine at americamagazine.org/subscribe

Support Inside the Vatican by subscribing to America Magazine!
http://americamedia.org/subscribe

Sign-up for our newsletter: http://bit.ly/2Ka4SOi

Follow us on Social Media:
• America Media on Facebook: http://bit.ly/2Kal3Ll
• America Media on Twitter: http://bit.ly/2viJosZ
• America Media on Instagram: http://bit.ly/2Ka5q6O

Support more videos like this: http://bit.ly/2vgqm6A